3 GOD SHARED OUR HUMAN NATURE - Was Jesus God? Richard Swinburne - freudeluomodio incrnazioneattesa nestorianiemonofisiti lavitaperfetta ascensione
3 GOD SHARED OUR HUMAN NATURERead more at location 684
3Read more at location 685
Note: Incarnazione... Un Dio che ama vuole condividere il dolore e i limiti della sua creatura... Come può un padre volere che suo figlio soffra? Spesso un genitore tollera e decide x la sofferenza del figlio se dietro c'è un bene maggiore. Per esempio: voglio che mio figlio vada a soldato x il bene della comunità... Come può una xsona sdoppiarsi? Come può una xsona avere una doppia natura (umana e divina)? Freud ci ha insegnato l' esistenza della doppia xsonalità. In qs modo Dio può creare un sè incarnato con sue credenze particolari e separate da quelle grnerali. Dio nn si limita ma opera in dimensioni differenti... Può Gesù fare del male? No, è umanamente xfetto. Perchè mai Dio nn dovrebbe incarnarsi in un uomo xfetto. Detto qs. vive le sue paure e le sue angosce x poter essere più vicino a noi. Anche lui è soggetto a tentazioji a cui può cedere ma che vince nella sua libertà... Il Dio incarnato a tratti xde la sua coscienza di essere Dio e sente la sua debolezza. È un'esperienza nn insolita: la paura ci fa dubitare delle ns. doti anche quando sappiamo di averle. Qs nn significa che Dio xda la sua onniscienza, semplicemente l'articola in varie dimensioni... Prr i cristiani il Dio incarnato è il figlio incarnato. Detto ciò il Figlio esiste cmq anche prima della sua incarnazione. Implicazioni: l'unigeneticità del figlio è compatibile con una pluralità di incarnazioni, sia in qs mondo sia nei mondi marziani... Anima. Per Platone è una parte della persona che la distingue dalle altre. Può essere pensata anche separatamente da quella xsona. Per Aristotele è una forma, un modo di pensare dela xsona stessa e nn può essere pensata a prescindere dalla xsona. Qs ultima concezione è più idonea al caso di Gesù che come persona già esisteva... Dottrina: Gesù nasce dall'unione dello Spirito Santo con una Vergine. Perchè invece il Messia non ha un padre umano? Perchè avere due "genitori" del genere simboleggia il suo essere uomo/Dio... Ascensione di Gesù: simmetria con la nascita miracolosa.. Edit
How will a loving God respond to the suffering and wrongdoing of these feeble but partly rational creatures whom he has made? I will argue in this chapter that a priori we would expect God to respond to our suffering and wrongdoing by himself living a human life. God would live a human lifeRead more at location 687
I will argue in this chapter that God would inevitably live a human life in order to share human suffering;Read more at location 690
Because of the goodness of humans having free choices, God has—I claimed in Chapter 1—a good reason to allow them to hurt each other;Read more at location 701
We ordinary humans sometimes rightly subject our own children to suffering for the sake of some greater good (to themselves or others); for instance (to use my earlier example) make them attend a ‘difficult’ neighbourhood school for the sake of good community relations.Read more at location 703
not merely would God have an obligation to live a human life of suffering, but God would have to show us that he had done this:Read more at location 720
that means that he must found a Church which, he would ensure, would proclaim this message.Read more at location 722
Being essentially divine, he could not cease to be divine. So a divine person could only become human by acquiring a human way of thinking and acting and a human body in addition to his divine way of thinking and acting.Read more at location 727
In contrast to animals, humans are capable of logical thought, among their beliefs are moral beliefs (beliefs about which actions are good or bad, obligatory or wrong), and they have free will. But clearly normal humans have these qualities in only a limited degree:Read more at location 730
Humans have a body when they acquire their beliefs through their bodies (from what they perceive and from what others tell them), and seek to realize their purposes through their bodiesRead more at location 735
So how could a divine person acquire this human way of thinking with its accompanying body in addition to but separate from his own essential divine way of thinking? It was Freud, the modern founder of psychoanalysis, who helped us to see how a person can have two systems of belief to some extent independent of each other.Read more at location 737
Freud described people who sometimes, when performing some actions, act only on one system of beliefs and are not guided by beliefs of the other system; and conversely. Although all the beliefs of such a person are accessible to him, he refuses to admit to his consciousness the beliefs of the one system when he is acting in the light of the other system of beliefs.Read more at location 739
mother may refuse to acknowledge to herself a belief that her son is dead or to allow some of her actions to be guided by it. When asked if she believes that he is dead, she says ‘No’, and this is an honest reply,Read more at location 742
The Freudian account of the divided mind was derived from analysis of cases of human self-deception, where a person does not consciously acknowledge either the beliefs of one belief system or the belief that he has kept its beliefs separated from his other system, and where the self-deception is a pathetic state from which that person needs to be rescued.Read more at location 747
Freudian account of such cases helps us to see the possibility of a person intentionally keeping a lesser belief system separate from her main belief system,Read more at location 749
but in becoming incarnate he could allow himself to have a separate system of semi-beliefsRead more at location 755
We thus get a picture of a divine consciousness and a human consciousness of God Incarnate, the divine consciousness including the human consciousness, but the human consciousness not including the divine consciousness.Read more at location 764
In becoming incarnate, God would not have limited his powers, but he would have taken on an additional limited way of operating.Read more at location 776
God Incarnate would also acquire human desires—for fame and fortune as well as for food and drink.Read more at location 779
Does this mean that God Incarnate would have been able to do wrong? Wrong is of two kinds: objective and subjective.Read more at location 784
Subjective wrong, the more serious kind of wrong, is doing (or trying to do) an action which you believe involves failing in your obligations to someone, for example, taking money which you believe to belong to someone else; and for that you are blameworthy or culpable.Read more at location 786
Now it would, I suggest, have been wrong of a divine person to allow himself to become incarnate in such a way as to open the possibility of his doing objective or subjective wrong.Read more at location 793
That is why it is wrong to drive a car when you have drunk too much alcohol:Read more at location 796
It follows from God’s essential perfect freedom and omniscience that he would not put himself in a position where he could have chosen to do wrong.Read more at location 797
Even though God Incarnate could not do wrong, he may, however, through not allowing himself to be aware of his divine beliefs, have been inclined to believe that he might succumb to temptation to do wrong and thus, in the situation of temptation, he could have felt as we do.Read more at location 800
It might be that in his human thinking God Incarnate was not always conscious of his own divinity;Read more at location 820
In summary, then, in becoming incarnate a divine person must remain omniscient, but he could allow his human actions to be guided only by his humanly acquired inclinations to belief. He must remain omnipotent, but there is a limit to what he could do in a human way and, when he acts in a human way, he need not always be fully aware of having more power than that. Being divine, he must remain perfectly free, but he could, in perfect freedom and because of the perfect goodness of doing so, allow himself to make a choice under the influence of a desire to do a lesser good. God Incarnate could not do wrong. He could, nevertheless, feel as we do when we are tempted to do wrong,Read more at location 822
The Nicene Creed affirms that God the Son, the second person of the Trinity, ‘came down from the heavens, and was incarnate…. and became human’.Read more at location 831
It taught that God the Son continued throughout his earthly life and thereafter to have a divine natureRead more at location 839
He was (after his conception) a single individual (hypostasis) with two distinct natures. This ‘Chalcedonian definition’, as it is called, was acceptedRead more at location 840
The form of words, ‘two physes’, ‘one hypostasis’, which the Council adopted was, however, rejected by two groups: the monophysites and the ‘Nestorians’. The monophysites (today’s Copts and some other quite large Middle Eastern groups) held that Jesus had only one physis, while the ‘Nestorians’ (today’s Church of the East, a small Middle Eastern group) held that in Jesus there were two hypostases.Read more at location 843
But, the Chalcedonian definition claims, God the Son also acquired at his conception in the womb of Mary a human nature. This nature is therefore a contingent nature; Jesus did not need to have it in order to exist.Read more at location 860
The Council of Chalcedon spelled out having a human nature as having ‘a rational soul and a body’.Read more at location 862
For Aristotle a soul is not a part of a person; but is a way of thinking and acting possessed by a person—inRead more at location 865
The Council bishops must be understood to be using the term ‘soul’ in Aristotle’s sense, for God the Son could not acquire a new soul of Plato’s kind since a soul of that kind is what makes the individual who has it the person he is, and the Son was already constituted as the person he is by his divine properties. Rather, the Council must be understood as saying that God the Son acquired a new way of thinking and acting.Read more at location 868
Jesus ‘was crucified’, and so died; that in the process he ‘suffered’; and that then he ‘was buried’.Read more at location 881
I shall be arguing in the next chapter that it would need to be a perfect life if God was to achieve another possible goal of his incarnation.Read more at location 886
how God the Son became incarnate, ‘from the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary’.Read more at location 891
God the Son could have been born of two human parents. But the claim is that Jesus had only a mother.Read more at location 897
But it would not have taken a very large miracle for God to turn some of the material of Mary’s egg into a second half-setRead more at location 899
But is there any a priori reason for supposing that, if God was to become incarnate, he would choose to do so by means of a ‘virgin birth’?Read more at location 901
partly by the normal process by which all humans come into existence, and partly as a result of a quite abnormal process. It would thus be a historical event symbolizing the doctrine of the Incarnation,Read more at location 903
The Ascension may of course have been symbolized, as some books of the New Testament claim, by his body rising upwards into the sky until covered by a cloud.Read more at location 916
Jesus became again united to his Father as fully as could be. And that, since there is no sense in which the Father has a spatial location, is how the claim that the Son is ‘seated at the right hand of the Father’Read more at location 920
honoured agent
